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  • Compliance and crypto asset payouts

T.M. changed the title to compliancy warning, possibly related to crypto payouts.

    Long story short, do NOT engage your BUNQ account with any crypto activity, you can use other banks for this purposes.

      @Saeid-Green-Hummingbird#225267 which ones please? I'm considering Revolut

        @tm-Turquoise-Owl#225268 Generally, BUNQ doesn't let you to use any of it's products and services engage with crypto once you do that they might close your account without any notice I believe they did a big favor to didn't close your account.because you already agreed all TandC of BUNQ. "wise" bank service are same as BUNQ, instead yes they online bank you've mentioned let you use their services for gambling and crypto.

          Das gleiche hatte ich auch letztens! Hab den Support angeschrieben was ich den falsch gemacht habe und bekam als Antwort ich solle mir für derartige Transaktionen ein Geschäftskonto eröffnen. Bei mir waren es wohl Transaktionen von Coinbase.

            4 months later

            Just today I had a similar query from BUNQ. Previously I searched their documents/terms for any restriction for using using my account to send/receive eur to crypto exchanges and there was not a single sentence regarding this kind of restriction. I transfered money from kraken.com, and they asked me for some documents and I sent the transaction log. No response yet. IF BUNQ has some restrictions regarding transfers from/to exchanges, they can simply wirte a sentence for this. Otherwise, leaving it as a gray area and sticking to such general terms like " intended purpose" does not help anybody. Plus, treating crypto as an only money loundering technology is similar to treating "dollar" also as a mean of money laundry. As soon as I use KYC'ed exchanges, there should not be any issue IMHO. BUNQ, please either write down your restrictions clearly if you have any, or better, find a better way to embrace this new technology.

              @New-Maroon-Zebra-1729158248#232518 There is a "fair use" section in the terms of services that asks customers refrain from using their accounts for high-risk activities like for example actively trading crypto assets. KYC procedures differ by country and by industry, so I wouldn't see it as strange for bunq to not blindly trust all transactions originating from and going to Kraken for example. Yes, bunq is definitely not a bank that is especially crypto-friendly and they don't try to market themselves as such. They're also not actively crypto-unfriendly, though. They just want to make sure there's no money laundering, terrorism financing etc. going on.

                @Jakob-Y#232520 Of course they have right and they have to make sure that there is no money laundering. Nobody is asking them to trust anybody blindly also..This is not what I am complaining here though. Don't know how you get this understanding from what I wrote. The thing is simple; they can either state that due to obvious concerns they don't accept such transactions from crypto exchanges, or they can find a way of collaboration with their customers or directly with KYC'ed exchanges for instance. Doing neither of them leaves us in gray areas as customers and causes hesitation to use BUNQ for every daily transaction. And plus, do you think other banks that accept such transactions from/to exchanges have a guilt on allowing money laundery and accepting everything blindly, or do they have other means to ensure the legacy of the transaction?

                  a month later

                  I’ve just experienced the same issue and I feel like the “general purpose” isn’t satisfying my “day-to-day” needs. If topping up my account from already converted crypto (i.e. Crypto.com Visa Card) is considered “illegal” then what can a person do with their BUNQ bank account when the money came from an exchange?

                    Jakob changed the title to Compliance and crypto asset payouts.
                      7 days later

                      @Saeid-Green-Hummingbird#225269 Also die war das mit Welcher app kann ich das TandC???

                        @New-Emerald-Dormouse-505407768#234190 Das Wort "TandC" im Kommentar von Saeidza bezieht sich auf die T&C - Terms and Conditions, also die Allgemeinen Geschäftsbedingungen von bunq. Die findest du auf bunq.com, die aktuelle Version unter diesem Link. Der Nutzer Saeidza hat in seinem Kommentar erklärt, dass bunq es sich vorbehält, Konten zu schließen, wenn sie vorrangig für Geldflüsse im Zusammenhang mit dem Handel von Crypto-Assets gebraucht werden.

                          Also bringt gas nix ich wollte 20000 € von blockcain doe Träum machen??

                            @New-Emerald-Dormouse-505407768#234193 Keiner hier im Forum hat Einsichten darin, wie und wofür du dein bunq-Konto benutzt. Du scheinst allerdings ein neuer Nutzer zu sein. Wenn du das Konto nur dafür geöffnet hast, um deine Krypto-Gewinne auszucashen, dann verstößt du damit wahrscheinlich gegen die Nutzungsbedingungen. Endgültig beantworten kann dir das aber nur bunq selbst. Du kannst sie ja mal fragen, wenn du spezifischere Informationen zu deiner Situation haben möchtest.

                              a month later
                              3 months later

                              I’ve been using my bunq accounts to purchase “cryptos” from different exchanges. Coinbase and KuCoin and a couple of others. I’ve yet to be warned. Hopefully it stays that way.

                                @Robert-Silver-Turtle-4265395482#240142 Some people created the bunq account for the sole purpose of buying crypto, I believe you generally use the account normally and occasionally buy crypto

                                  a year later

                                  @Robert-Silver-Turtle-4265395482#240142 Could you give information about your trading volume and frequency? According to these parameters, you may not be stuck with the compatibility query.

                                    10 months later

                                    They have now clarified this in their T&C (Terms and Conditions) section 10.2 Financial misuse, see citation below:

                                    10.2 Financial misuse

                                    At bunq, we believe in giving you the freedom to use your money the way you want it. However, we also have a legal obligation to prevent the misuse of the financial system. To keep everyone safe, we ask that you follow our fair use policy.

                                    Our accounts are meant for everyday banking use, such as making payments and saving money. It is not meant for business activities or receiving charitable donations, for that we offer business accounts. To minimize the risk of misuse, we ask that you avoid using your account for these higher-risk activities:

                                    • Gambling with large amounts of money;
                                    • Using a personal account for Business purposes;
                                    • Depositing or withdrawing large amounts of cash;
                                    • Actively trading or investing in real estate, forex, precious metals, crypto assets, or unregulated markets;
                                    • Receiving, spending, or sending money to countries that are considered high-risk by the European Union or have a low score on the Corruption Perception Index from Transparency International.

                                    Please note that this list is not exhaustive, and we may terminate our relationship with you if we notice any other high-risk behavior on your account. We assess each situation on a case-by-case basis.

                                    If we do notice any concerning behavior, we may terminate our relationship with you at any time, even if we initially allowed the behavior or did not take action against it.

                                    We hope you enjoy using your bunq account and appreciate your cooperation in keeping our financial system safe for everyone.

                                    See source: https://www.bunq.com/documents/personal

                                    And what annoys me the most is while they forbid you to buy crypto they talk about it in on their bank pages and whatnot or their promotional pages, see this for example: https://www.bunq.com/blog/what-is-crypto-currency-the-decentralized-finance-guide

                                      There seems to be some ambiguity about crypto. What is meant by 'actively trading'? A single trade, or multiple trades, and it there a cap on the total amount traded per transaction, per time period or something similar? Does it matter whether or not crypto trading is done through regulated exchanges such as Bitvavo that are under supervision from the Dutch National Bank (the regulator)?

                                      I do understand bunq needs to comply with regulations but I do not believe regulations forbid transacting with crypto exchanges perse. It would be good is bunq would provide more clarity on this matter.

                                      I am a happy user of bunq, and I do wish to continue using their services, but a complete ban on crypto exchanges would be a deal breaker for me personally.