• 'Vocal minority'

The bank of the free should allow us to freely choose our preferred app.

    @JohnDo#176635 I consider myself silent majority; I use bunq since 2016 and this is the first time I speak up on the forum (this is my 3rd post, all today), because I feel addressed by Ali’s remark about “the silent ones”.

    But I very much disagree with the implication; I also feel negative about the upgrade. In my case it also means I’m silently planning to leave. (I think bunq showed an unreliable move twice this year, and consider that not bank worthy. I’m not asking for anything on V3, nor an apology, but if it comes (also about the process, not even feature-wise) it’s really the only way I see myself stay. Though my wife is even pushing me to leave, with her reading up on what happens, and the apparent censorship.)

    The point is:
    If people don’t feel comfortable or passionate about speaking up on the forum, they (I) also don’t want to be treated bad, ignored with happy emojis, played down. It’s not an invite to share my thoughts. This is how it’s perceived by me if I would suggest something at the moment.) They want to be respected, not disregarded by moderation. I don’t see any positive reaction on criticism that in principe I agree with. It’s often even censored away. This means I rather stay silent. No point in addressing it to support directly, or speaking up about the things I consider valuable.

      @JohnDo#176635 I don't want to make this topic about V3 specifically, but rather the way bunq seemingly cherry-picks feedback to justify the choices it makes. SuperGreen is an example of this.

      bunq isn’t giving its users the best tools and motivation to donate money to environmental charities. It could implement ‘saving goals’ that automatically transfer to a charity that the user can select from a curated list. It could implement this for all users. Instead, bunq decided to create another more expensive subscription that gives the user no control or insight in their contribution to this tree planting cause. It doesn’t donate the €9 monthly (the added cost of the sub.), it donates an unknown amount and displays trees instead. Objectively, you can say: bunq markets ‘contributing to an environmental cause’ to sell a more expensive subscription. That is what is called ‘greenwashing’.

      Ok, so when vocal users display their discomfort with this ordeal, bunq responds: ’81% of our users want this’.
      We need to stop and unpack this. I’m not 100% sure, but I believe a limited poll showed that bunq users find environmental causes important. As I have described above, there are other (better) ways of providing more useful tools to answer that demand. bunq is not stupid. They are very good at solving problems, but their problem is not to answer that demand, its problem is that it needs to generate more revenue because it isn’t profitable.

      Now, we’re at the beginning of an oscillating mechanism between bunq and its most engaged users. Because bunq is not engaging on the actual topic these vocal users don’t feel heard and as a result the tone hardens. In response to this, bunq is reacting even less to the most frustrated users, the voiced grow louder and so on.

      If bunq would let its guard down and communicate openly and honestly, all this user potential wouldn’t have been wasted like it has.

        @JohnDo#176635 Another small thing about the three types of users you describe. All feedback that comes out of them, silent or rude, it is all gold. To only consider feedback with certain specifications is the same as considering no feedback. If bunq wants to listen to its users (which Ali always says is at the heart of bunq's 'success'), it should listen to all voices. Maybe it does this already though. This is in response to your view on the matter.

          There seems to be a difference of opinions on what the ‘silent majority’ thinks. Many people have the (misconception) that silent means happy. I don’t believe this is the case. The silent people may not leave, they may not post comments, but that doesn’t mean they’re as happy as they used to be.

          The difficulty is, the opinion of this group is very hard to measure. That’s why you have to go by the information that you DO have. The large number of people responding and voicing their disappointment proves to me that the majority of the people isn’t as happy as they were, as no other change before brought this number of people to the forum to voice their disappointment.

          I hope bunq will listen to the opinion of the people, because frankly: bunq STILL is the bank that offers the best functionality of any (Dutch) bank. The lay out generally is a step back in my opinion, but that doesn’t mean bunq can’t salvage the best of both version.

          In my opinion, bunq would be optimal if it has the layout of V2, combined with the account overview of V3.

            @JohnDo#176635 The longer bunq ignores the complaints, the more “critical vocal ones” become “rude vocal ones”. If you keep ignoring your users and deleting their critical feedback, of course they’re going to lose their patience. I don’t blame them for losing their cool.

            Unfortunately, bunq hasn’t focused on a single group of those you mentioned, they’ve only been focusing on Ali’s opinion. That’s pretty apparent if you just look at some really unintuitive design decisions that have been made. Design mistakes that beta users had reported minutes after the beta was released. And these design flaws are still present in the app.

            And all we have to go on is Ali saying we should realize the bigger picture of what bunq is doing? What is the bigger picture? I wouldn’t know because bunq is sitting in their ivory tower yelling how exited they are every few days without any mention of what bunq is actually trying to accomplish with this new app.

              @JohnDo#176635
              Sie sollten in Betracht ziehen das es nicht nur darum geht wer auf welche Weise Kritik artikuliert. Es gibt eine Reihe schwerwiegender Probleme mit dem App - Update die weit über Geschmacksfragen ( „ meine Frau mag es oder nicht“) hinausgehen. Sie sollten die Haftungsfolgen , die rechtlichen Ansprüche der Kunden berücksichtigen die zum Beispiel entstehen wenn Geschäftskunden keinen Kontenzugang mehr haben, falsche Salden angezeigt werden, Kreditkarten nicht mehr funktionieren.
              Die Handhabung hier von ernsthaften Anliegen von Kunden werden ignoriert. Man verweist nur arrogant darauf „ Der ( dumme?) Kunde wird sich schon an unser Update gewöhnen“ . Die Probleme der App sind so schwerwiegend das Ihnen nichts anderes übrig bleiben wird als eine Reset auf V2 durchzuführen . Je eher dies Bunq eingesteht und es auch umsetzt kann Schaden noch abgewendet werden. Nach meiner Einschätzung werden Sie ca die Hälfte Ihrer Kunden verlieren , und dies in einem sehr umkämpften Markt , einen Verlust vor Steuern in 2018 ( gemäss Geschäftsbericht) von - 11€mio und hohen Personalkosten, ist es fraglich ob Ihr Unternehmen 2021 noch existiert.
              Aber machen Sie ruhig weiter mit Ihrem überheblichen Gehabe als Bunq wie „toll“ sie sind. Dieses Update wird der realitäts- check für ihr Unternehmen sein.

                @-Violet-Chaja#176787 Hi 👋🏼 René,

                I meant to say (in general) I definitely think bunq listens to feedback, but the reasoning behind choices and bunqs direction could be communicated a bit more. I also meant to say that there is a whole world of users that exists outside the typical social media channels.

                I also think bunq does a lot of data and market research before they make decision. They share even some of those numbers.

                Is the recent update all sunshine? No, see my feedback here: https://together.bunq.com/d/30470-exploring-the-amazing-bunq-v3-let-us-know-how-we-can-make-it-even-better-2/500 (and feel free to comment there)

                Are breaking bugs 🐛 fun? Absolutely not, ever breaking bug in any release is one too many in my book. And if they happen a company shoot work day and night to fix them. I definitely can understand any frustration if they effect you.

                I know and understand not all the people aren’t always happy - to say the least - with the choices that bunq makes. I’m also not always 100% happy. But I still think bunq fits my needs by far the best. And I have the feeling I’m be heard by bunq. Do they make mistakes? Yes, absolutely.. but they learn from those is my experience.. again this is just my personal opinion.

                I would urge everybody, also the silent ones, to share their opinion publicly or privately (support@bunq.com or in-app chat). Also if you just want to make a compliment or share a positive experience. Just keep things constructive and respectful.

                  @JohnDo#176809 I‘d like to address the data and market research point.

                  I think you’re referring to the trees. I think no one is against trees, planting trees or even bunq offering to plant trees for you. I can even understand people wanting "to do something" without the hassle of having to figure out what NGO would be best for that. Also, I can understand bunq in trying to enter a green market that promises better margins and a more affluent clientele.

                  The problem only starts with bunq‘s execution. It’s very aggressive and "in your face", maybe even trying to guilt-trip people into "upgrading". It’s way past "Hey, we’ve got a nice offer here. Can I interest you in it?"

                  I imagine you‘ve done your research. So you know there‘s a German fintech that started out as a "green bank" and that offers something similar to Premium SuperGreen. Their app isn’t as sophisticated as bunq‘s and they have their own kind of problems. The difference in the way they communicate to and with their customers is striking.

                  You complain about the way people talk here at Together and ask them to stay positive. I ask you to imagine for a minute or two that all these people here aren’t madmen and that they didn’t dream about bashing bunq just for the thrill of it.

                  My English teacher always said "It takes two to tango" and Michael Jackson sang about starting with the man in the mirror. It‘s not only ungrateful customers at fault for this pile of broken glass.

                    @JohnDo#176635 My wife is the silent one. She started using Bunq as her main bank when she joined me in The Netherlands.
                    Today, she used the V3 app for more than just authorising iDeal and grew from bored, to annoyed to mad in lesser than a hour. Then she dropped everything and stated she’s going to leave Bunq.

                    She doesn’t care about technology.

                    Now I need to find another bank for her.

                    Silent ones don’t spend time leaving feedback or threatening. “Rude” feedbacks at least give you numbers on how many customers are pissed. Silent ones just leave.

                      @JohnDo#176635 I partially agree with you, we should all be constructive and polite.
                      There are a lot of dissatisfied people about V3, they’re frustrated by the new design and prefer the old one. Bunq should be constructive and allow those users to use the V2 app, while Bunq works on V3. Instead Bunq calls it an amazing app and sees us a childish whining minority. That’s why some users become rude, they’re just mad at the arrogant response.
                      So if Bunq would be a little more constructive and ask us what we really dislike, most people would stay polite and constructive. ✌🏼

                        @Kacper-Navy-Panther#176891 Actually it isn't even about the design. There's a lot of functionality just broken, especially around the virtual cards, but not limited to that.
                        Leaving people unable to pay does trigger emotions. And all that without a need. They'd have had weeks and even months to test and verify essential features.

                          @Tom-Indigo-Tiger#176690 Yeah this is what bothers me the most as well... I adviced people to switch to bunq because I find it important to share the things I find valuable. Now I am rather embarrassed for those people...

                            @dmnk#176893 I can’t freeze my online cards and it took me 5 minutes to figure out how to make a payment. So I really can relate. Again you’re right that they’ve had plenty of time to test and review this app. I can understand that a new app can be buggy, but not a banking app. We’re talking real money and not monopoly bucks.
                            For now, let’s just hope that Bunq will temporarily bring V2 back, and implement the simplicity of V2 into V3.

                              @JohnDo#176635 John, to group 3: I see it the other way round. Many of the so called ‚rude‘ go back to v2 or I leave people are real ambassadors, that have been giving many constructive feedback in the past. If Bunq manages to cause even this group to threaten to leave, sometjing is really, really wrong.

                                I think the people from group 2 and 3 would really appreciate to see a statement from bunq their side.

                                I hope they will bring one out regarding the current situation and the what will happen the coming weeks.

                                  @R#176906 Well, a simple we’re sorry for ignoring and calling you a ‘vocal minority’ would be more than appreciated. Alongside a proposition to use V2 as long as V3 isn’t improved.

                                    I’ve actually never posted here, but would like to add that for me a message from Ali himself would be much appreciated.

                                    Bunq is my primary bank and I’ve been a happy bunqer for a few years now. The update to V3 doesn’t actually bother me that much (some things need fixing, but that’ll sort itself out). What I’m more concerned about is the way Bunq handles the aftermath of this upgrade. Reading about fake reviews, deleting negative comments and banning users from Together made me reevaluate how I think about Bunq. I’d still very much like to see them turn this around by explaining what went wrong in V3 and what they’re going to do in the future. I really enjoy using Bunq daily, and would hate seeing it fail because of unnecessary things like this!

                                      De kwestie blijft helaas dat bunq niet of nauwelijks doorheeft dat het angst voor gebrek aan betrouwbaarheid zaait. Dat alleen al zou een reden kunnen zijn om bij een bank te vertrekken, iets wat bunq zich volgens mij niet echt kan permitteren. Ik ben premium-member, dus mij persoonlijk heeft het niet geraakt, maar ik heb wel gezien hoe bunq zich bij en na de abonnementswijzigingen van eerder dit jaar gedroeg. Dat kan gewoon echt niet. Die wijzigingen doorvoeren is natuurlijk hun goed recht, of je het er nu mee eens bent of niet. Maar ik ken werkelijk niemand die vindt dat bunq daar correct in gehandeld of over gecommuniceerd heeft. Terwijl bunq zelf doodleuk mooi weer bleef spelen, doen alsof er niets aan de hand was en zelfs tegenspraak (OOK de constructieve) wegcensureerde. Of bunq daarmee nu wel of niet of de stille meerderheid naar eigen inzicht goed bediende, is dan allang niet relevant meer: zij komt op deze manier over alsof zij haar eigen klanten niet serieus neemt en zelfs minacht. Dat neem ik bunq weldegelijk kwalijk, ook al raakte de abonnementswijziging mij niet en zal er ongetwijfeld van V3 op termijn iets te maken zijn.
                                      Ik merk echter wel dat mijn vertrouwen ook nu minder wordt. Ik hoef nog steeds die MetalCard niet, vind het een mooi product, maar ik draag al op andere vlakken mijn steentje bij aan de planeet, dus kies ervoor om dat niet ook nog eens via mijn toch al prijzige bank te doen. En toch wordt er dan continu gepoogd om mij tòch aan die kaart te krijgen. Mails, irritante app notificaties, niets lijkt te gek. Dat is dan nog te begrijpen, maar nu moet ik er in V3 kennelijk ook nog eens dagelijks op gewezen worden dat ik iets mis en ergens niet bij hoor of zo. Zo hoor je gewoon niet met klanten om te gaan, als je zegt ze zo te waarderen en naar ze luistert. Ik zie dat, denk terug aan hoe bunq eerder dit jaar de abonnementswijzigingen (zeg maar gerust niet) communiceerde en denk: ik kan kennelijk elk moment een mailtje krijgen dat mijn abonnement is omgezet naar SuperGreen, twee keer zo duur wordt en als ik dat niet wil, dan heb ik gewoon pech. Dat lijkt me toch een serieus probleem voor een bank, als zelfs het vertrouwen van je tevréden klanten al tot dat niveau gedaald is? En als je er wat van zegt, krijg je alleen marketing prietpraat terug, die totaal niet ingaat op je problemen of je zorgen. Ook voor bunq geldt: Communiceren kun je leren. Ik snap niet waarom dat zo moeilijk voor ze is, er zijn overduidelijk marketeers voor het bedrijf aan het werk, Communicatie is letterlijk les 1 bij de opleiding daarvoor. Waar is al die arrogantie, kop in het zand steken en censuur voor nodig? Als ik dat okay vond, dan was ik wel bij mijn vorige bank gebleven. Kom op bunq, je kunt beter (en zult wel moeten ook)...